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2014-11-10 21:25, IP:, from Mexico 0 positive reactions 7 negative
Thank you united States I'll use the info you gave me. And yes a carrier does not express the disease and does not give puppies expressing the disease, however the vW carrier gene does pass to the next generation although de recurrence is less with every generation, but if a breeder is producing vW carriers he is not taking care of his matings and if other have two carrier studs something is no right JMHO.

2014-11-10 20:30, IP:, from Bulgaria 4 positive reactions 2 negative
Mexico - you have a lot of research to do if you think that a vWD carrier bred to a vWD clear can produce an affected: it absolutely cannot. Out of a carrier x clear mating 50 percent of the offspring will be carriers and 50 percent will be clear, this is basic Mendelian genetics. Once a line is bred clear, an affected cannot suddenly pop up out of nowhere in future - you would have to breed two carriers or a carrier to an affected or two affecteds to have the chance of getting an affected dog. But like America said, this is the least of your problems.

You cannot make the assumption that Dobes from one continent are healthier than another - it depends on the lines. When I was in in Mexico I met breeders who had dogs live to 12-14 with no problems, and likewise I know breeders here with long lived dogs. Dobes are dropping dead at young ages everywhere, sometimes it is reported, but mostly it is not... DCM, cancer, stomach torsion... those are the big killers and what you should really be worried about, and now Wobblers is being seen more frequently. If you have the chance to visit breeders there in person, ask to see their old dogs. If you find a mating from parents who are say 5-6 years old, and whose parents are alive at 10, and have grandparents that also lived to similar ages etc., that is as good as chance as any for a healthy combination, but of course not a guarantee.

Like I said before, research lines you are interested in the databases (, etc.), paying close attention to the lifespans of the dogs. If you see an entire 3 generation pedigree with dogs dying at ages 4-7, that's a big red flag and what I would personally try to avoid. However, there is no foolproof way of getting a healthy Dobe these days with the declining gene pool and the state that the breed is in.

As for importing a dog, if you want to get the temperament you want, and you don't know the breeder well, you should pick the dog up in person (it's cheaper than paying for the pup to be shipped by cargo anyway). Temperament is not a given and what might be right for one person may not suit another.

2014-11-10 17:21, IP:, from United States 4 positive reactions 1 negative
We all want healthy Dobermanns. But with the wide spread health problems
the odds are not in your favor. Google Dobermann Health Problems.
Read about the problems that plague the race worldwide. Thia is why it is important to
find a breeder that produces one litter a year and why it is important to stay away from
the commercial Dobermann breeders. Quality not quanity. Less is best.

2014-11-10 16:03, IP:, from Mexico 0 positive reactions 2 negative
Maybe I'm overthinking if I want work or show, but actually I want a midle point, is dificult for an european dog to win BIS and IPO 3 dog needs very specific mental characteristics and I know is very dificult to find. I had two american line dobermanns, both amazing with the family, but the first was a scared dog and the second was really good and responded well to protection training but she died at two years old from osteosarcoma (i know ti may or may not have genetic components). So I want a dog as healthy as possible, I know a lot of things can happen but at least not genetic issues. I now heart diseases can kill in a minut, HD can diminsh life quality and may be is more frecuent. I am not an expert but I know what vW disease is and I understand genetics, vW can be "corrected" but one carrier breeded with one healthy diminish probabilities to 1 in 4, still high if you ask me, if those dogs are not bred carefully it can appear anytime.

Plus, here are only few european line breeders and as far as I can see they are talking bs to eachother, so I'd like objetive opinions about the lines they use so I can have a better idea of what to choose cause I have decided to buy here.

And I have seen a lot of pesimism about the ban on docking and cropping, but ears an tail do not define a breed IMHO. And people that don't want to show their dogs are going to do it any way. What I'd like to know is how that is going to affect the exchange of dogs from North america

2014-11-10 05:40, IP:, from United States 6 positive reactions 0 negative
In my opinion you are over thinking this. It is not difficult to find a good Dobermann.
First you have to find an honest breeder that is working/titling and health testing.
Someone that produces one litter a year. Stay away from the commercial breeders.
If you are not going to work the dog in IPO then don't bother to research these kennels.
If you are looking for a pet then find a pet quality breeder but don't expect the mentality to be good.
Don't expect all breeders to be honest with you. Your problem is you don't know enough about the race
to make a good choice. vWD is a problem in the race but there are far grater health problems to worrie about.
A vWD carrier is the least problem. It can be corrected in one generation with the right breeding choices.
A carrier is just a carrier, put to a clear dog you reduce the problem until it just goes away.

Portugal is spot on. FCI countries are in trouble on 1Jan15

2014-11-10 05:11, IP:, from Mexico 0 positive reactions 2 negative
I began searching kennels a few months ago, I am focusing right now in finding a dog with as least genetic diseases as possible, I know how I want it phisically, I want a dog that can work at a good level, not a super intense one because he's going to be with children in some point. I can see Doberman working proyect is about IPO dog breeders -it's all over de site- and I can see that only a few of the kennels listed are famous in conformation, wich was suprising because the usual thoughts are that european lines are not separated in working and comformation. I also found a couple more european line kennels here and I saw in te pedigries that some of them have a dog carrier of von Willebrand with vom Ferremberg and van Neerland stam blood and other vW carrier with Aurachgrund blood, which stops me from buy there. The other possibilities here are one kennel that uses del Nasi mainly and Elite House and de Grande Vinko (whose dogs I like very much), the last one has some dogs with von Bayern, Eschenbrug and Aurachgrund mainly. I understand that basicaly the first has dogs more suited for show and the second for work. These are my two options of kennels here in my country, I read in previous posts about von Bayern but can you give me your opinion or a little more info about the health of the lines they have?
Thank you very very much

P.D. Portugal I think you are overreacting

2014-11-09 23:28, IP:, from Portugal 8 positive reactions 2 negative
dobermann is over with ears and tail . R.I.P 2014

2014-11-09 18:58, IP:, from United States 4 positive reactions 0 negative
I don't tell people what to do I can only tell you what I have done in the past for my dogs.
I found that they have a way of telling me when it is time to go to the vet.
In the past I used to find ways to prolong the problem. I would say just one more week then just one more day. In the end a week or a day did not matter. Do what is right for the dog.

2014-11-09 18:42, IP:, from United States 0 positive reactions 0 negative
We have an 11 year old doby who has really begun to show her age. She is having a hard time getting around, she collapses often. She has many fatty tumors. Any thoughts???

2014-11-08 01:14, IP:, from Bulgaria 2 positive reactions 1 negative
Mexico: the list on the Working Dobermann Breeders Project is incomplete. It was just launched this year by breeders based in the US. The working line Dobermann population and the community is fairly small, do your research first on the various lines and the health problems in the breed, look at the longevity in the lines you like - then find a breeder you're comfortable with.

2014-11-07 22:53, IP:, from United States 1 positive reactions 0 negative
Just remember that the breeders on the Working Dobermann Breeders Project
produce working Dobermanns from Weastern European blood lines. Most but not
everyone have competed at a local, national and some at an internastional level.
Most of these breeders want to sell to people that are interested in IPO.
If you are just looking for a family pet, these breeders will not be for you.

2014-11-07 21:41, IP:, from Mexico 2 positive reactions 0 negative
Bulgaria I didn't see te kennel you wrote in your post I focused on the pages you told me. I have seen the pages of those kennels you told me and a couple more of the working dog and working doberman project web sites (thank you united States) and found very interesting information about breeders here and in other countries.
I think I am in a similar situation with the other United States , my primary goal is to get a dog with as less genetic issues as possible, then a working dog that fits in the standard. I hope the community could help me with the doubts that come to me in the process of searching the best kennels for me. I had a couple dogs american line, but I really want an european line dobermann now.
Thanks for your help

2014-11-06 20:12, IP:, from United States 3 positive reactions 3 negative
The Working Dobermann Breeders Project
is the best place to start researching for a good breeder.
To most of these breeders IPO is still a sport and not a business.

2014-11-06 18:51, IP:, from United States 1 positive reactions 1 negative
Yes the health is most important to me. I have been trying to learn more about healthy breeding and pedigrees but the training itself is what I'm most interested in. I am looking for a good working dog for schutzhund training. I have a couple trainers lined up to help me but I still need to find a good dog. I have plenty of time on my hands for training right now but I have a lot to learn so I'm just gonna wait. Thanks for your response.

2014-11-06 14:57, IP:, from Serbia 5 positive reactions 0 negative
If you're still new and learning, i would advise you to wait and not hurry.
Explore and learn as much about race in order to avoid future disappointments. Read between the lines and ask around as much as possible about the health of ancestors and how long they lived. Today there are very few real breeders. What are your priorities when choosing a dog? Do you want show dog or working Doberman? Anyway, in both cases dog's health should be a priority.Doberman unfortunately suffers from many diseases and live shorter and shorter. (DCM,cancer,wobler,head tremor and many other diseases)
Finding a responsible breeder is not easy but it is possible.
I told you what i think about Bazille vom hexenzauber-quite rare genetics and healthy and longevity ancestors.
Unfortunately, for Nanuk I can't say that.

2014-11-06 05:47, IP:, from United States 1 positive reactions 5 negative
Thanks very much for answering my question with all that information on Bazille. Im still new and learning so I really like to here what you guys with years of experience have to say. These two were bred over in europe before she was imported to US and I was interested in getting one of the puppies next month.

2014-11-06 03:20, IP:, from United States 0 positive reactions 2 negative

2014-11-06 00:46, IP:, from United States 0 positive reactions 2 negative
Thanks very much for answering my question with all that information on Bazille. Im still new and learning so I really like to here what you guys with years of experience have to say. These two were bred over in europe before she was imported to US and I was interested in getting one of the puppies next month.

2014-11-06 00:35, IP:, from Mexico 0 positive reactions 2 negative
Thank you all for your suggestions, I'm searching right now..... In the previous post I meant that I was in contact with an European line breeder here in Mexico , but I only know that kennel (Ok I know a couple more but with not a good fame regarding quality, health and good care of their dogs), if any of you know another kennel here I would be really thankful.
Greetings to all

2014-11-05 19:36, IP:, from Bulgaria 4 positive reactions 2 negative
Mexico, it is much cheaper for you to pick up a dog in person than have it sent to you via cargo. I sent two pups to Mexico about 6 months ago and they were picked up personally with no problems. If you want show lines, you can start by having a look at this website - look at show results, litter announcements etc. and you'll most likely find what you're looking for. Also, many breeders are listed in the database. For working lines, try, you also have working line breeders in your own country. You might want to contact von Zeus Tal or Bergkönig.

2014-11-05 16:27, IP:, from United States 2 positive reactions 1 negative
I will give you a web site where you will find many good Dobermann breeders. Google
The Working Dobermann Breeders Project.

2014-11-05 15:01, IP:, from France 4 positive reactions 0 negative
I sent a puppy to Mexico 5 years ago the owner travelled to Paris & took the puppy back with him no problems at all, he also founder this was cheaper than the puppy flying alone in cargo .

2014-11-05 14:52, IP:, from Mexico 1 positive reactions 1 negative
Bulgaria, I've Bee in touch with a european line breeder too, but that's the only one I know and they have several del Nasi dogs, and a couple other West Europe lines. If you know other could you give me the info? If it is permited in this forum

2014-11-04 20:09, IP:, from Bulgaria 3 positive reactions 4 negative
Mexico - if you are looking for working lines there are some breeders in your own country have imported directly from Europe and have sent some pups back to Europe as well as to the US (ie. you can get a good pup meeting them and looking at their dogs in person). Without a doubt though, if you are looking for European show lines, then you should look to Europe for a puppy... and no, the breeders are not lying about being able to send you a puppy from Europe. From Europe to Mexico, it is not a problem. Your biggest challenge will be finding honest breeders with lines that you like, who will actually send you a decent dog. Without connections, that is not going to be easiest of tasks.

2014-11-04 17:16, IP:, from United States 3 positive reactions 1 negative
Older dogs entering Mexico via auto is not the problem.
All they need is proof of Rabies to get back in to America.
The problem comes when a pup is shipped by itself via
air carrier to Mexico. Pup must have proper health certificate
issued by a vet that is listed with USDA. The health certificate must be stamped
by USDA and a Mexican official in America must stamp and issue a visa.
Then the pup can be exported. A pup the same age can just drive over into Mexico
with out a problem.
I suggest buying your pup from Europe, the quality will be much better.

2014-11-04 13:54, IP:, from Mexico 1 positive reactions 1 negative
United States I also have talk with a couple of people from western eurpe and they told me it was no problema to send dogs to México... Unless they were just trying to convence me. I want to do my research and buy in about a year anyway. I'd love to have clubes of the changes of the tendency of te dobermans in this continent with the changes of the standard, I have no idea of what de dobermann club here is thinking.....
Serbia, that info is really nice, a lot of the pedigríes I 've see have dogs that only lives 7 to 19 years

2014-11-03 14:51, IP:, from Serbia 9 positive reactions 2 negative
This dog represent old and today quite rare v. Bayern bloodline (together with v. eschenbruch,mooreiche,v. d. weyermuhle working lines).Wery interesting pedigree with strong linebreed to Cassy v. Bayern.Real refreshment for today all the same genetics...
This is "old fashion" looking dobermann for todays standard ,but dobermann with great caracter and most important great health.
This is longlived bloodnine (more than 10 years):
Ero von Bayern knapp 14 Jahre (*09/78- 07/92)
Elb von Bayern 13 Jahre
Enzo von Bayern 13 Jahre
Cassi von Bayern 11 Jahre
Chicco von Bayern 14 Jahre und 10 Monate
Debby von Bayern 11 Jahre
Yoko von Bayern 11 Jahre
Susi (Yago-Tochter) 12 Jahre
Xaro von Bayern 10 Jahre
Uran von Bayern 11 Jahre
Quint von Bayern 11 Jahre
Kara von Bayern 11 Jahre
Hella von Bayern 12 Jahre
Jano von Bayern 03/1998 - 01/2011
Justus von Bayern 03/1998 - 12/2011
Jaska von Bayern 12 Jahre
Baccara (Eiko-Tochter) 12 Jahre
Olga von Bayern 09/2000 - 02/2013
Lara von Bayern 2000 - 2012
Nero von Bayern 02.09.2000 - 02.05.2014
Kero von Bayern 09/1998 - 06/2011
Patricia von Bayern 2001 - 2013
Ronja del Pais Baviera 11 Jahre
Rebell del Pais Baviera 11 Jahre
Resi del Pais Baviera 11 Jahre
Samba del Pais Baviera 05/2004 - 04/2014
Shira del Pais Baviera 10 Jahre

2014-11-03 07:51, IP:, from United States 1 positive reactions 0 negative I could use some opinions from people with more experience. thanks

2014-11-03 10:03, IP:, from United Kingdom 12 positive reactions 1 negative
Heads up to any Dobermann breeder who cares where their dogs end up. The UK rescues (and websites for unwanted things) are doing a great 'trade' in unwanted European Dobermanns (cropped and docked).
It's mostly Eastern European kennels - who sell to anyone who asks. This weekend a nice 18 month old brown cropped and docked male was re-homed....the owner in England simply decided 'he didn't want him anymore'.

We know a lot of breeders care, and there are a lot of good owners of cropped and docked dogs here, but mostly it's just an image thing. What is worse is that those breeders who are just interested in the money, are selling no questions asked, so males are ending up in novice homes.

The name of your kennels is well known and if you keep using the UK as a dumping ground with no questions asked to your buyers, I will post the names on here of your puppy farm.

2014-11-03 07:51, IP:, from United States 1 positive reactions 1 negative
I could use some opinions from people with more experience. thanks

2014-11-03 00:25, IP:, from Bulgaria 3 positive reactions 1 negative
It's actually pretty easy to bring dogs to and from Mexico, that's a load of crap about the paper work. I've sent a couple of dogs there from Europe and I know handlers that travel between Mexico and the US/Canada to show, so it's definitely not impossible. Most American breeders don't like exporting overseas for reasons of their own.


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