Traditional lines in Grece

[BasKal]

Kaliniki and Kaloni are from a litter of 6 by Ch.Baron Nike Renewal and Ch.Eloise of Kraft Hill.
Ch.Eloise of Kraft Hill (lulu), is also the mother of Ch.Horama Lulu's Castor and Siegerin Horama lulu's Circe, from a litter with Ch.Jivago di Casa Coppo, and the mother of jungensiegerin Simba with Ch.Eric of Kraft Hill.She is the ONLY greek champion bitch with kids and grandkids Champions. Ch.Eloise of Kraft Hill, was by Ch.Graaf Norrland vh Wantij (Hargos vh Wantij-Gladys v Hermanjomaik) and Jessica des San Marin (Hertog Conan v Mannensheide-Carita des San Marin).
I didnt bred from Kaliniki, she is co-owned with friends and may she will be bred in the future. Her sister Kaloni had Elektra, and her sister Kalypso has a very nice male from a breeding with Nitro.There is also a nice female junior winner from my co-breeding with a nice greek male Ector V Haus Naoumi, from their sister Kalliope.

[Weinberge]

BRAVO ! . Good. I liked what you make !

[Weinberge]

I found all pedigree and make it in my database.
Send me in mail please brother pictures of Kalinki if you have ( alinsaga68@yahoo.com ). Have one clear and very good pedigree.
I think yours next step is one pure Campovalano or Diamante Nero.
We will talk in mail please .

[BasKal]

Kaliniki has not brothers alive.They died in accidents.This is her sister's son from CAYA Cirrus, Energo, a CAC winner.He is an own brother of Elektra.
Energo Vom Haus Liopiris at 17 months:

[Weinberge]

Energo is a good male. I am happy when i see good value in dobermann breed and i see old and pure genes alive .
Kaliniki have one extreme elegance, and i like very much.

[BasKal]

This one, (Horama) Troas, black Female, CAC-RCAC winner and BOS winner is the mother of my Jaipur (Jaipur is by Indo V Franckenhorst IPO1, SchH1. I did the mating when Indo was 9 years old - he is alive and well at 10+ ). She is the result of breeding from dogs I bred or co-bred with friends with other kennel names, but I choosed the matings. She was described in public by Florindo Coppo as "really possesing THE type of the dobermann, regarding the head and neck". She was best female that day. She is a great grandaughter of my foundation females, Ch.Eloise of Kraft Hill and Siegerin Prinzess Keri Vaic Stamm (Baron Nike Renewal-Hesta Royal Bell), and a grandaughter of my other foundation female Tamal (Choremi's Kreon-Itaca della Ripuaria).
The other female founder of my dobs (who is not in the pedigree of Troas), is Prada del Riobianco, (Nero del Diamante Nero-Sophie del Riobianco). She is the grandmother of Horama Horama IPO3, and Horama Hera the mother of Dienekes and Demetra a multi CAC winner.She is also the Great grandam of Horama Riverman in the tail female line.
Troas (Gina): Sire-Ector v haus Naoumis (CAYA Cirrus-Horama Fimi) x Dam-Horama Mnymosyni (Horama Lulu's Cyclops - Tamal "di Casa F-N").In the future she may be bred to a young Nitro del Riobianco son.

[BasKal]

It is not bad to keep a tradition in bloodlines, actually all really great kennels stuck on their lines and tried to keep them alive, improving gratually.Breeding with the recent winner only, is stupid. Maybe it is tempting to follow fashion, but the long term results are not rewarding.
Many usually young and not very clever persons are very ready to jump on the train of fashion, and lose respect to the older lines.This is more true for countries like Ukraine, Romania, Russia and even Greece.
The situation in these countries is the hunt for fast results and money.Also, many new breeders have an individual preference for "beauty" (???) wich is not in harmony with the standart.They breed what they think as "modern" type, wich is a very faulty dog.The problem is that many judges, not the great ones, are admirers of this type of animal.The head sometimes resemples a Rottweiler, the feet are short, the dogs are overfed, overangulated behind and they have not character.
But the best Ukrainian kennel (Grande Vinko) is based on an very old female line, as other succesfull kennels like Rensdorff, with roots to older USSR lines.
On the contrary in Greece, the older and best breeder keeps buying dogs, from Ukraine and Kroatian kennels and his own older lines are continued by others- this is not good. He runs in shows with foreign bred dobs, and most of his breeding are pets.
The interned opened "bussiness".In a very little time all dobs will be omogeneous in pedigree, health problems and faults.

[Weinberge]

Baksal, write to me please Jaipur pedigree. IS son of Indo if i understand well. Mother , grand-mother , lines please?

[Weinberge]

About what say Baksal in last post i agree with him.

[BasKal]

His mother is (horama) Troas the female in the above post picture.Here is her pedigree:


..........................Baron Nike Renewal(Prinz v NordenStamm-Borana Sawages)

................... CAYA Cirrus

.......................... Galaxy Gwendy(Gr.Festus Neerlandstamm-Belona)

......Father:Ector v Haus Naoumis

......................... Jivago di Casa Coppo(Overdryve di Casa Coppo-Jehny di Casa Coppo)

..................Horama Fimi

......................... Princess Keri Vaic Stamm(Baron Nike Renewal-Hesta Royal Bell)

Horama TROAS (mother of Jaipur)

................. .......Jivago di Casa Coppo(Overdryve di Casa Coppo-Jehny di Casa Coppo)

................ Horama Lulus Cyclops

........................ Eloise of Kraft Hill(Gr.Norland v.het Wantij-Jessica des San Marin)

.......Mother: Horama Mnymosyni

........................Choremis Kreon(Unic du Carre D'as-Biona des Landrys)

.................Tamal di casa F-N

........................Itaca della Ripuaria(Sir Harold v Franckenhorst-Giada di Montespino)

[BasKal]

Indo Is by Paco v Wieteke's Hoeve -- Zari v Franckenhorst.

[BasKal]

Indo v Franckenhorst at 9 years:

[BasKal]

Ch.Jivago di Casa Coppo (Overdryve di Casa Coppo-Jehny di Casa Coppo):

[BasKal]

Ch. Eloise of Kraft Hill at 17 months.3 CAC, (by Pezzano, Van Morfoot, Naveda Carero, Test of Character (at 17 months) by Pezzano: "...she has exactly the character that is required by the standart":

[Weinberge]

Sorry Baksal. I do not understand exactly.

Tell me 2 generation of pedigree of Horama Troas

parents
1.
2.

grand-parents
1.
2.
3.
4.